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Gregorius Goldstein
Ze One Man Show
1806
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Posted - 2017.01.25 10:31:42 -
[1] - Quote
Vortexo VonBrenner wrote:Helios Grim wrote:What part of this discussion suggests I'm not actually seeking help? Asking carrier questions in New Citizen's Q & A. It's such a strange thing to do it makes people wonder if you are trolling.
To be fair, EVE is the game that has a basar for highly skilled pilots. When I would buy a carrier pilot and a carrier I had to ask a lot of stupid questions myself too - as I only fly subcaps. |

Gregorius Goldstein
Ze One Man Show
1806
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Posted - 2017.01.25 16:39:19 -
[2] - Quote
Valid points. And I don't even fly battleships much because I still lack the ISK and skill to do it comfortably. Everything with small and medium guns is just fine for me. And I am definitely not going to buy a carrier pilot. And even if I did I would ask carrier pilots in corp for help with the fitting and stay aligned to station all the time when ratting. And I also know that GÇ£Everybody come and halp, my ratting Hel got tackled, how should I know that neutral had a cyno?GÇ¥ is a perfect way to make yourself look like an idiot.
I just wanted to point out that the game design of EVE kind of encourages GÇ£newbie carrier pilotsGÇ¥. And I donGÇÖt like the GÇ£if you have to ask donGÇÖt fly itGÇ¥-answer much because why should I warn other pilots to fly expensive loot pi+¦atas? Go for it and see how it works out everyone. Some may succeed; some may lose it at the first day out.
ShahFluffers wrote:Quote:To be fair, EVE is the game that has a basar for highly skilled pilots. When I would buy a carrier pilot and a carrier I had to ask a lot of stupid questions myself too - as I only fly subcaps. To be fair... in my opinion... if you buy a lot of skillpoints or an older character so that you can fly big honking fleet level ships you give up any pretense of being a newbie and are essentially saying, "nah, I don't need to go through that learning process first... I got this!" And that means... 1. This question should be in Ships and Modules. 2. You will be treated the same way every other veteran who asks these kinds of questions will be (see: if you have to ask such basic questions about capitals, you should not fly them). Now, if you are as capable with sub-capital ships as you say you are, then fitting up a carrier to kill NPCs should be trivial. And you should already have a firm grasp on how to look up ship requirements and how to get the most out of any ship you want to fly. And you should also quickly see why carrier ratting is VERY RISKY and can easily be done by a much cheaper sub-capital. |

Gregorius Goldstein
Ze One Man Show
1814
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Posted - 2017.01.26 15:17:23 -
[3] - Quote
ergherhdfgh wrote:Gregorius Goldstein wrote: I just wanted to point out that the game design of EVE kind of encourages GÇ£newbie carrier pilotsGÇ¥.
Could you please add more detail to this statement? My experience of Eve is the exact opposite of what you are saying here. At my first reading of that statement, my knee jerk reaction was that you've totally got the wrong idea of Eve and are imposing concepts learned in other MMOs onto Eve. I'm willing to consider that maybe I've missed something but I am very curious what makes you say this.
There is no bound to character, bound to account, bound on equip or bound on pick up loot in EVE, most games I know have this concept to some extent. Usually you canGÇÖt buy GÇ£endgameGÇ¥ stuff with ingame currency and you canGÇÖt buy ingame currency with real money from the company running the game either. In a lot of games the best equipment drops from raids and endbosses, is quite rare and binds to the player picking it up. Or at least to the first account using the item. And is it absolutely not common that you can buy skills and GÇ£higlevelGÇ¥ characters for ingame and by proxy real money either. ThatGÇÖs because most games try to pretend there was no GÇ£pay to winGÇ¥ option and the best stuff can only be reached by the best players.
EVE is different. If you are willing to risk your money you are welcome to do so. You are not forced to grind raids until stuff drops, you are not forced to gather experience points until you reach the highest level, you can just buy everything. All you need is either time or money. The killmails and the drama this option generates are part of the EVE gameplay in my opinion. I totally agree, that everything in EVE letGÇÖs most people come to the conclusion that just buying yourself into big ships is a bad idea. Because it does not matter what skills your pilot has, your own players skills are what matters. BUT the option to bypass the journey is there and a small fraction of people will use it just because they can, why not, YOLO, no poors, whateverGǪ
CCP themselves tell their customers: GÇ£DonGÇÖt fly what you canGÇÖt afford to lose and bigger is not better.GÇ¥ But I am sure that they are 100% aware that this wonGÇÖt stop some players from doing it anyway. And I guess that they see this as part of content creation and perhaps are even quite happy about it because it generates cash and adds to the special GÇ£unforgivingGÇ¥ flavor of EVE. What is possible in EVE and what is an good idea are quite different things.
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Gregorius Goldstein
Ze One Man Show
1814
|
Posted - 2017.01.26 15:35:07 -
[4] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:thats not really encouraging GÇ£newbie carrier pilotsGÇ¥, any other mmo you can simply just rmt your way to the top stuff, ccp try to cut out rmt by offering the stuff themselves, so you are saying while other mmo's dont offer buying stuff from the company for real money they are essentially encouraging rmt?
Yeah, bad wording, sry. CCP encourages "Pay-to-Win" carrier pilots. And it is up to debate if you win anything that way. But you can do it without third party RMT and without the risk to get your account banned. That PLEX>ISK>Injector>morePLEX>bigShip chain is quite unique to EVE. Sure, some people may buy a MMO account on EBAY, but I think the "against the EULA" part hold most players back. To much risk of a ban. CCP got rid of that risk. That is all I say.
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Gregorius Goldstein
Ze One Man Show
1814
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Posted - 2017.01.26 15:40:51 -
[5] - Quote
Keno Skir wrote:
Capitals REQUIRE experience in-game to be used with any degree of safety. If someone does not have this experience it can be assumed they bought the skills / character and SHOULD NOT be encouraged.
But capitals REQUIRE no in game experience to lose them either. That is the beauty of EVE. |

Gregorius Goldstein
Ze One Man Show
1816
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Posted - 2017.01.28 19:46:55 -
[6] - Quote
ergherhdfgh wrote: Oh ok now I understand what you are saying. I totally see your point with the exception of you putting the blame on CCP and vets looking for easy KMs. I'll explain... But first I want to say that I think that us vets and CCP out of our way to try and explain it but new players just don't believe us because it goes against everything they learned in other games.
Yes Eve is different in many ways. First off there is no end game in Eve so your comment about not having to grind raid bosses for end game gear is at best a moot point and more likely just completely mis-guided. No ship in Eve is any better than any other ship. Each ship has it's uses and everything in Eve is situational.
In other games a level 90 character doesn't even have a chance against a level 100 character and a character with a gearscore a couple hundred points higher has exponential factors of power over a lower geared player. In Eve a carrier is not better than a BS or even a cruiser or a frig it's just different. In Eve people don't fly cruisers because they can't afford battleships they fly cruisers to do stuff that cruisers do well and fly battleships for stuff that battleships do well. A very new player in a very small cheap ship can get under the guns of a very high skill point character in a very expensively fit Battleship and pwn him. You will never see a level 10 beating a level 100 in WoW.
I think that there are a few more points about Eve that you are missing...
Nice, than we are on the same page as I don't "blame" CCP nor anyone looking for easy killmails. I am even quite fond of the fact that you can buy almost anything in EVE because they made it so that you can blow up nearly everything too.
And I can see the difference between EVE and didn't miss the points you wrote down. I agree with them all. Only thing I wanted to point out is that is a bit funny that people are "OMG where do all those new carrier wannabe pilots come from" in a game that offers a fast track. Is it stupid to take the fast track? Abolutely! Is it a wonder that it keeps happening? Not so much. Should you warn players even when they didn't ask for it and are adamant to go for it. Up to dabate. |

Gregorius Goldstein
Ze One Man Show
1816
|
Posted - 2017.01.28 19:49:19 -
[7] - Quote
Chihuahuaraffe wrote: You can always offer to be a Personal Capital Training Instructor for the small sum of, say, five billion isk per month, and help redistribute their wealth a bit :) And besides, exploding Carriers make the economy go 'round!
Yes, my point exactly. If anyone ask if something is risky one should give good advice, if someone wants to undock nice stuff why would one interfere?
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